25 December is the Roman feast of the winter solstice (Day of the Birth of the Victorious Sun), which Christians transformed into the Day of the Birth of Christ, the Sun of Righteousness, making it an . The Lord promised his Victor would be the seed of a woman when he cursed the serpent (Genesis 3:14-15). The general term for this place was Sheol, which could be translated "the grave" or "the realm of the dead." who prophesied " longed for the arrival of an era of grace. Jesus also referred to this place as "paradise," when He promised the thief on the cross next to Him that he . It has been . the presence of God. No one, either prior to the cross or since the cross, would ever be saved without that one pivotal event in the history of the world. Jesus (c. 4 BC - AD 30 or 33), also referred to as Jesus of Nazareth or Jesus Christ, was a first-century Jewish preacher and religious leader. Some 800 years before Jesus died, Isaiah wrote of His death in the past tense, "…the LORD has laid (27:27-31). So Jesus would have been born in September. In one sense, salvation has always been the same—it is by God's grace through faith. "And Jesus said to him, 'Assuredly, I say to you, today you will be with me in Paradise'." (Luke 23:43) The Bible reports that sometime between His crucifixion and His resurrection, Jesus went to hell. And fwiw, many Christians do not believe that any Jews - before or after Christ's birth - got into Heaven. 1 Peter 3:18-20 18 For Christ also suffered once for sins, the just for the unjust, that He might bring 6us to God, being put to death in the flesh but made alive by the Spirit, 19 by whom also He went and preached to the spirits in prison, 20 who formerly were disobedient, 7when once the Divine longsuffering waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was being . The exact place in Bethlehem where Jesus was born cannot be known, but we do know He was born in Bethlehem of Judea. To meditate on the two events is to see the magnitude of the change. This statement also tells us that Jesus went to His Father upon death. For more information visit: http://www.reasonablefaith.orgIn January of 2019, Dr. Craig was invited to sit down with Erik Thoennes of Grace Evangelical Free . They are in their graves or what other means of rest their in. Generally speaking, the two sections of scripture that deal with this are found in Ephesians 4 and 1 Peter 3. She was saved before the time of Christ, when the Israelites entered the promised land. Hades, on the other hand, remains in tact, and those who die apart from faith still go there. So John was likely conceived in the second half of Sivan, which is around the beginning of June. 4:8, "When He ascended on high, He led captive a host of captives, and He gave gifts to . the presence of God. Among those who died in Theresienstadt, or were deported from Theresienstadt to the death camp Auschwitz or survived the horrors in Theresienstadt, were individuals who were Christians of Jewish . The Gentile is a woman named Rahab. The " prophets . Before Jesus was buried to await being resurrected, however, something happened that only the hand of God could perform. " Its Greek name is Hades. So the point, Adam, is that people before Christ were saved by faith, and thus went to heaven when they died, and those who did not . This is possible because Jesus . A Before the cross, the spirits of those who died in faith of a coming redeemer went to a place that came to be known as Paradise. because i leant those that that died and didnt believe christ will rot in hell. The town sat on a 2500 foot ridge. . Share. We all need to make sure we have put our faith and trust in Him. 4 Surely he took up our infirmities and carried our sorrows, yet we considered him stricken by God, smitten by him, and afflicted. One account from St. Epiphanius says that St. Joseph died at the ripe old age of 90 around the year AD 18. In eastern Christian communities, they used a Greek calendar that placed that same Passover on April 6. Bethlehem means House of Bread. The Old Testament taught life after death and that everyone who departed from this life went to a place of conscious existence. The book of Enoch is quoted liberally in the New Testament. Then they led him away to crucify him. Those who die now in faith in Jesus go to Heaven, i.e. It seems that in the time between Jesus' death and resurrection, Jesus descended into Sheol and released those from Abraham's Bosom and led them to Heaven. 10. Still, if we take these at face value, Jesus was likely born between the years 6 and 4 B.C. 3 He was despised and rejected by men, a man of sorrows, and familiar with suffering. These people who were saved without knowing the name of Jesus were still saved by Jesus, according to Heb 9:9-10:8, John 8:56, Luke 2:29-31, 1 Tim 4:10, 1 Pet 1:10-12. Jesus referred to it as the "heart of the earth" ( Matthew 12:40) and it was the abode of the righteous dead prior to Jesus' resurrection. It was located in Sheol, which is Hebrew for "the abode of the dead. That… is not quite accurate. Like the universe, time is His creation and, like the universe, it does not constrain Him in anyway. Historians and theologians agree that Jesus was approximately thirty-three years old at the time of His crucifixion. But the Bible reveals that this is a mistaken assumption. Acts 2:29 Men and brothers, let me freely . So, I believe, the OT people were saved by faith in God. It's where Lazarus went. If Jesus was born in 5 B.C. Verse 19 They went to Hell (or Abraham's bosom), Jesus emptied it and at the end this empty Hell will be like a match thrown into a mostly empty gas can (the lake of fire) And that Hell will keep expanding forever. In fact, the reason they would carry out the sacrifices, and the reason they would do all the things God told them to . It shows that no one could get into heaven before the Lord's blood was shed for them. James 2:20-26 tells us that she was saved. Many people today assume that people who have died with the Spirit of God are now in heaven. so wat will nw happen to those that were born before the birth of christ and didnt have a chance to know christ You asked a very good question and you shall find it (Read Proverbs 2 . #14. It is my belieef that christ came to this earth on a mission ;so to speak. Jesus was there… The Christian view is that Jesus Christ is God, the 2nd member of the Trinity (Father, Son & Holy Spirit). This Hell (Abraham's bosom) isn't the same Hell as the lake of fire will become. Abraham trusted the Lord by faith. It would have been impossible for a Jew to do something without it having reference to the Messiah yet to come. Eph. When it was all over and the ghetto had been liberated on May 8, 1945, there were about 19,000 survivors. He is the central figure of Christianity, the world's largest religion.Most Christians believe he is the incarnation of God the Son and the awaited messiah (the Christ), prophesied in the Hebrew Bible. Answer The Old Testament believers went to a place of comfort and rest called "paradise" when they died. Justification is a legal standing before God where we are declared righteous before God regarding his holy law. Add nine months and that's how Christianity came up with two traditional dates for Christmas: Dec. 25 and Jan. 6. To many scholars, however, it is more of an indication that he grew up there; the four gospels agree on that. The Bible speaks of Jesus as "…the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world" (Rev 13:8). They were saved by the grace of God through their faith in the Savior, even though this Savior was only a promise at the time. The Awassi sheep is a desert sheep, a fat-tailed breed that has existed in the Middle East for an estimated 5,000 . (as argued above) and began his ministry, as is indicated by all four Gospels, shortly after that of John the Baptist (that is, in the latter part of the year A.D. 29), this would mean that Jesus was about . There is deba te on what happened to Jesus during the period after His death and before His resurrection. The only other place in the New Testament that ellogeo is used is Philemon 18 where . The word Paul uses ( ellogeo) is not the same word for "imputed" in other contexts ( logizomai; Rom 4:11, 23-24). Ken Sublett // Jul 12, 2009 at 10:24 pm. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts In Relationship. This is explained in the Story of the Rich Man and Lazarus ( Luke 16:19-31 ). The most difficult part of faith to me, is the part where you have to actually have faith. Adam and Eve, for example, had faith in God and fellowship with Him. Joseph's absence leaves no room to question who Jesus' Father is. Baptism, which corresponds to this, now saves you, not as a removal of dirt from the body but as an appeal to God for a clear conscience, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ, who has gone into heaven and is at the right hand of God, with angels, authorities, and powers subject to him." - 1 Pet 3:18-22. (Houma, Louisiana) A. 4 yr. ago theist. Jesus on three days in the grave went to the bounded spirits and preached a second chance of repentance so that by the blood of Jesus they would be forgiven their sins and get back to heaven with jesus. Yet, the truth is: This is the same fate for those who lived during and after the Christ. Approximately 33,000 died in this ghetto. 2. Consider this definition, and think of the implications of it against the backdrop of ou 101 Answer s. "Christians before Jesus was born" is an oxymoron. . Its was because man had sinned and god so love us that he sent his only son to die for our sins, As far as those before he arrived I think I will let god judge that. Jun 28, 2011. It is true today. Press J to jump to the feed. Like us, the Old Testament saints were not saved by their adherence to the Law. These early believers listened closely to the words of God as they were revealed by the prophets and the Scripture. Beyond this we know very little about where Jesus was for three days. And God is independent of time. When our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ came to earth and was crucified for us, it opened the door to Salvation, as in Eternal life. No, those who lived and died, before the Christ, didn't go to hell, nor would they go to heaven. The fact that Jesus was called Jesus of Nazareth points very heavily towards Nazareth being his birthplace. Hades has two compartments, the abode of the lost called in the Bible "torment," and the other side, the place of the saints of God called Paradise, and also referred to as "Abraham's Bosom." The amazing truth is that a future resurrection is coming for this one great purpose—to offer eternal life to those who lived their entire lives without knowing the true God and His Son. They believed God's word as much as was revealed to them, and knew their own sinfulness. The suspect who killed 19 kids and two teachers at an elementary school in Uvalde, Texas, was a local high school student with few if any friends who officials said legally purchased two assault . He would go to jail regardless of the amount he stole from the bank. Sincerely, Theophilus Dear Theophilus, Since Adam rebelled at the beginning, the Creator instituted only one way for a person to be declared righteous and that is through repentant trust in the coming Victor. God is all-wise and omniscient. And suddenly the veil of the temple was ripped in two from top to bottom . November 17, 2010 at 7:30 pm. For His existence is completely independent of the known universe. The suspect who killed 19 kids and two teachers at an elementary school in Uvalde, Texas, was a local high school student with few if any friends who officials said legally purchased two assault . That is why it says in Hebrews 12, that Moses could foresee Christ, even Moses. To be God, you have to be eternal, un-created, always. You receive salvation by the grace of God, through having faith in Jesus as your Savior. Laurie has preached on the subjects of Heaven and Hell on a number of occasions, and in April said that people make up their own decision on where they will end up. This has deep theological implications for our faith on multiple levels, and I regard that as a very good thing. It was a place of comfort. Tiberius reigned from 14-37 AD as the second emperor after Augustus. Reply. i am not as sure as some that their will be so many saved from reading the bible.Not all who are not saved will go to hell as I read it but may not enter . Vast as it is, if God could be described in spatial terms, He would exceed the universe to an infinite degree. Later in the chapter, Luke mentions that Jesus was approximately thirty years old ( Luke 3:23) when He began His ministry, which lasted about three years. There is no such thing. First, part of the problem in Romans 5:13 is the poor decision by some Bible translators to use the word "imputed.". John Malalas, Chronicle 10.1: "In the 42nd year and the fourth month of the reign of Augustus our Lord God Jesus Christ was born, eight days before the Kalends of January, on 25th December, at the seventh hour of the day, in a city of Judaea named Bethlehem, which is near Jerusalem.". Jesus said, "Father, forgive them!" (LUKE 23:34). Jesus' mercy towards the mob and the soldiers, including the Centurion. It is six thirty on Christmas eve, and 55 degrees; two hours after sunset. The Jews also called it Abraham's Bosom. My dictionary defines "pagan" as "a follower of a. Answer Since the fall of man, the basis of salvation has always been the death of Christ. Here's a biblical hint! The major difference is that before Christ's earthly life, salvation was found in faith in the Lord. So, as 2 Corinthians 5:8 states, "to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord" holds true then as it does today. One of the things Jesus did before he appeared on earth in Bethlehem was create the universe. The parable of the Rich Man and Lazarus (Luke 16:19-31) seems to indicate that there were two parts of hell. 27:35-36) for His few possessions and watch Him die, Jesus prayed for their forgiveness, not His own escape. Jesus had to be born again because he died spiritually when he "became sin" for us. My first instinct is to quibble with your use of the word "pagan" to describe all those who lived on earth before Jesus. Then the Medici l. So, I believe, the OT people were saved by faith in God. For example, in El Inferno, Dante asserts that all those who were born . US-Others. "Those who died before Jesus never had the opportunity to trust in him because His crucifixion hadn't happened yet, but they were saved by faith the same as we are," he added. From paintings and movies, we generally picture God the Father as the sole Creator, but the Bible provides additional details: In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. (NASB) Hebrews 11:31. March 22, 2008. I encourage you to read the whole story Jesus told in Luke 16:19 - 31 about the rich man and Lazarus but the following verses make . Because Jesus died, the holy, distant, and fearful God now lives in men and women of faith. It was here in a cave near the village that that Justin Martyr (c. A.D. 150) said Jesus was born. In fact, the reason they would carry out the sacrifices, and the reason they would do all the things God told them to . Ok, now let me return to the gentiles who never heard the gospel, and lived before Christ died. So Joseph is most likely death. Salvation includes justification. Jesus took our place in everyway and died the death due us. People of those times were called by the name of his father - Jesus, Son of Joseph - or by the village they were born in. Three places..A place of storage was made for those who Jesus visited after He defeated Hell and Death; from before the flood. You can't believe Christ is the son of God if there is no Christ. Jesus referred to it as the "heart of the earth" ( Matthew 12:40) and it was the abode of the righteous dead prior to Jesus' resurrection. Shecaniah. No, he never sinned, but he willingly bore all that was due us-death in it's totality. . By faith Rahab the harlot did not perish along with those who were disobedient, after she had welcomed the spies in peace. Quoting: Oh Boy Here We Go! It was also called Ephratah or Ephrath. Ecclesiastes 9:5,10 say that those who die know nothing at all, their love, their hate and jealousy has . It will remain true in the future. I don't know how old the Earth is, (but I know what you mean - young); 2.) No. This does not mean that a person's chances are better if they never heard of Jesus. If you read the bible you would know this answer. To sum it up, all gentiles (or Jews) who ever lived are guilty. In fact, Ephesians 4:9 says that Jesus "first descended into the lower parts of the . According to the Gospels. They were called Hell and Abraham's bosom a.k.a. According to the gospels of Matthew and Luke in the New Testament, Mary was a first-century Jewish woman of Nazareth, the wife of Joseph, and the mother of Jesus.Both the New Testament and the Quran describe Mary as a virgin.According to Christian theology, Mary conceived Jesus through the Holy Spirit while still a virgin, and accompanied Joseph to Bethlehem, where Jesus was born. The bible doesn't teach a heaven or hell concept, it teaches the . This makes the Gospel of John even more astonishing to read, as Jesus knows the Father, is in the Father, and is worked through by the Father, even as the Father. Christ's death paid the penalty for past sins of Old Testament saints and future sins of New Testament saints. Adding the six months between John and Jesus, and the nine months of Mary's gestation, brings us to around the middle of September the following year. Luke 23:42 states, "Truly I say to you, today you shall be with Me in Paradise.". By his death and Resurrection, Jesus opened heaven (CCC 1026). According to historical accounts, Jesus Christ was born on the 25th of December in a cave. Prior to that time all who died went to "hell"; however, the just went to a place in hell referred to as "the Bosom of Abraham," where they would be comforted. Up until that time the Church had the theory that there was no enlightenment until Jesus showed up on the planet, and everyone who lived before his arrival was living in some kind of "limbo" in the afterlife. This . As they sat down to gamble (MATT. It seems that in the time between Jesus' death and resurrection, Jesus descended into Sheol and released those from Abraham's Bosom and led them to Heaven. What Happened In The Lower Parts of The Earth. The story also holds that Jesus' birth was heralded by a star — the Star of Bethlehem. In A.D. 31 on the Day of Pentecost, the apostle Peter said of David, "that he is both dead and buried, and his tomb is with us to this day" ( Acts 2:29. That is why it says in Hebrews 12, that Moses could foresee Christ, even Moses. We know from Jesus' statement to the thief that when one dies they enter the presence of God immediately. Instead, those who died believing from their Old Testament studies that a redeemer was coming to save them from their sins went to a place the Jews called Abraham's bosom or Paradise. Like one from whom men hide their faces he was despised, and we esteemed him not. 5 But he was pierced for our transgressions, Answer (1 of 7): People do not have a soul inside of them that is immortal, a person is a soul, it is the entire person and Ezekiel 18:4 says that the soul that is sinning, it itself will die. If Joseph was 50 years old when Jesus was born and Jesus were 30, that means Joseph would have been 80 years when Jesus start practicing messianicism (or whatever we can call His occupation is). Life expectancy in ancient time is around 40. (the ones who never had Moses, prophets, or Yeshua) BUT the main two places, Abrahams bosom, a place of peace and rest until the . This is a monumental change brought about by Jesus' death. In Rome and other western locales, they calculated Passover in the year that Jesus died as occurring March 25. They believed God's word as much as was revealed to them, and knew their own sinfulness. According to Luke 3:23, Jesus was "about 30 years old" when he began his ministry. The distant terrifying God is now near and intimate. Jesus Participated in Creation. Even the theft of only $1 would establish his guilt. The flesh and spirit of men have not changed since our Father created us. Praise God, the Messiah has now come. Bible Indicates Paradise Was Once Part Of Hades. Hades, on the other hand, remains in tact, and those who die apart from faith still go there. This includes those people who lived before He died. This was true in the days of the Old Testament saints -- before the atoning sacrifice of Jesus Christ. James is probably Jesus' little bro. Based on the rather stark silence in the New Testament coupled with tradition, St. Joseph had died before Jesus' public ministry, though exactly when we don't know. Jesus also referred to this place as "paradise," when He promised the thief on the cross next to Him that he . Those who die now in faith in Jesus go to Heaven, i.e. 81064607. To suggest that these people who came back to life were in resurrected bodies before Jesus arose from the dead contradicts the clear teachings of Scripture that Jesus was the first one to be raised from the dead in a resurrection body: [Jesus] is also head of the body, the church; and He is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead (Col. 1:18). Abraham's Bosom was located "down below" the heavens in the depths of the earth. Paradise . NB: am a christian bt i wnt to knw wat wil happen that were born before christ came. . (Matthew 27:51) The veil mentioned in the gospels that tore when Jesus died hung between the Holy of Holies and the Holy Place. . Jesus taught us that there were only two places for those that die physically to go, before the cross. Salvation BEFORE the Crucifixion of JesusNavigate. Answer (1 of 39): This is the question that started the Renaissance. The " Spirit of Christ " within them was filling them with this great desire, witnessing through them and to them in advance of the work of Christ. A Christ-led, Spirit-given understanding of this gospel theme was the core of the prophetic message. The Church teaches that those who died in friendship with God before the Resurrection went to a place in Hell called the 'Bosom of Abraham" This teaching reinforces the doctrinal idea that Christ is central to salvation, as it is through his life, death and Resurrection, that the possibility of eternal life is made real. In the mind of God, Christ's death was as good as done, even before the world was created. The month and day of Jesus' birth we do not know. They Knew About Grace. The wonderful answer to the last part of the question is yes, they can be saved. There's arguments that the shepherds would only be out if they were lambing, and so obviously Jesus was born in the spring. Otherwise Jesus did mankind a great disservice by commanding us to spread the Gospel. 12. First of all we need to clarify two quick things: 1.) Sin is Not Imputed. Apr 7, 2017. 11. Those who died before Jesus never had the opportunity to trust in him because his crucifixion hadn't happened yet, but they were saved by faith the same as we are. Before Christ's death on the cross at Calvary, the souls of the dead went to Hades, a supernatural place somewhere in the heart of the earth. Abraham's Bosom was located "down below" the heavens in the depths of the earth. This is a common question raised.